ELECTRIC FUEL PUMP

[Jacko]

As i think has been hinted at, loctite and fuel (depending) or air gaps are not a good mix... can explain if anyone needs clarification

[spider]

As i think has been hinted at, loctite and fuel (depending) or air gaps are not a good mix... can explain if anyone needs clarification

Loctite works in the absence of air, it is what is known as an anaerobic. This is why a good fit is necessary to start with. Fuel isn't a problem. For the brass tube coming out of the fuel pump, the most appropriate grade is 561.

[lawriemoke]

Famous last words. I tapped the housing with a 1/8NPT thread to take a new secure fitting. When I installed the new pipe I succeeded in splitting the housing. I suspect it was already cracked which is why the old pipe fell out, GRRRR.

I've ordered a new pump, still the same style because I wasn't sure that the SU style mechanical pump uses the same spacer block or if I would have need a new spacer as well as a new pump.

Such is life. If the courier performs I will have the new pump to install on the weekend.

[Tim]

You're probably better off with a new pump. Brett (bnicho) mentioned the problem with a torn diaphragm where you end up with fuel leaking into the sump and filling it up. Its rare, because the pump usually fails at the same time so it gets replaced, but it can happen.

The choices for replacement pumps seem to be a lot narrower since I last bought one. The better ones had the pipes retained with a threaded nut, and the actuating levers were made of solid metal rather than pressed, but a quick scan of the online sellers looks like they're cheaper and nastier now (like a lot of things).

Tim

[sa mokin]

www.minisport.com

Genuine Mechanical SU Fuel Pump - 998c, 1969-90
part number: AZX1818

cost: £26.53 = 42.69 plus postage for the real deal or

www.minisport.com.au

Mini SU fuel pump (mechanical) **REQUIRES spacer**
part number: AZX1818

cost: $66 plus postage

Spacer -  Fuel pump spacer block 12mm
Part No: GUG705603GM
cost: $24 plus postage


Why mess around with second rate parts?   

[lawriemoke]

Thanks, I agree

Time and ignorance drove this decision. I wasn't sure if I needed a different spacer to the one I have.
If (or when) this one fails I'll go to a better quality unit.

[spider]

Thread Revival!

I know Lawrie's problem is likely resolved now.

Earlier in this thread, i did say I favoured Mechanical Pump. These are still a good simple reliable pump and would suit most of us here for sure.

I do have a mechanical pump in my own Moke, however 2 issues I have with it, being the outlet comes too close to the exhaust, and the other being when hot, it doesn't suck a dry line too well, ie, after running out of fuel,  it took more than 5 minutes of cranking to get fuel up, it took just about every last electron in my battery to get there! SA and HP had the same issue on our CY Trip last year. We were all running the same pump, the Quinton Hazel one and all were new.

With the installation of my new fuel tanks I did decide to re-think the type of pump, mainly from the dry pump point of view. I looked to Facet first and they steered me on to Ashdowns as the local Agents. After consulting the Ashdown Catalogue, they did have a LP Type that would suck up 900 mm and only 3 PSI. You beauty

Well, that was short lived. After getting said pump (and a spare), the info within said it would only draw up 300 mm. Consulting the Facet Website confirmed that. I got back on to Ashdown, who did take some care looking in to it and they came back a day later agreeing with me and that they had a typo in their catalogue. Back to Facet, who got back to saying they had one model that would do what I was after, but it was a low production type and only one small guy in the US purchased / stocked them. Mmmm,,,,, time wasn't on my side for that.

After another week and about 6 zillion emails / phone calls later, I ended up at Fabre Australia. They have an SU Pump which is for a Morris Minor that would do the job. They did have them in stock but very expensive. That's what I've ended up with, a bit bulkier than I would have liked and rather fussy on exactly how it gets mounted. Being what it is, it only had a threaded tube for the inlet (FM 1/4" BSP) and no mounting bracket available. Ah, after spending 5 times what the Facet unit is worth, more parts to make to get the darn thing working,,,,,,,,,

edit> I could have settled for a higher pressure Facet Unit and then had a separate regulator, but I wanted to avoid that route.

[bnicho]

On the Shitbox Rally the mechanical pump fitted to the van started spewing fuel out the diaphragm.  We did not have a spare mechanical pump, but we did a have a Facet unit I threw in from my Moke's spares stock.  I know these pumps are meant to be fitted next to the tank.  While we had wiring in the loom to allow it to be hooked up, it would have meant cutting the metal fuel line and fabricating a pump bracket - on the dirt at Tjukarila Roadhouse.  No way!

I mounted the Facet in the engine bay near the wiper motor and plumbed it in, bypassing the mechanical pump.  It rattled away at first and would not prime up (suck up any fuel).  Disconnecting the outlet end of the pump allowed it to prime.  With everything reconnected it worked just fine.  However I did have to prime it like that again after we ran out of fuel.   

[olivia_jason]

I prefer electric pumps:

- I've never had one fail, unlike mechanical pumps.
- No vapour lock problems when mounted correctly.
- Easier to change at the side of the road.
- Every wrecker or auto parts store has a replacement that will get you home if your one fails. 
- No fear of a failed diaphram dumping fuel into the sump and diluting the engine oil.
- Gives an additional anti-theft option. 
- They become very noisy when you are about to run out of fuel, giving you a warning to pull over before the float bowl empties.   

Cheers,

agreed and many of the brand named electric fuel pumps can be rebuilt cheaply and easily at home eg holley and so

[lucksafortune2000]

Another quick funny story for you all.
I used to own a VH Valiant Pacer.
One particular afternoon I filled it up with fuel and parked in my usual spot at home, which was reversed up a very steep hill.
(You know where this is going already don't you).
In the morning the engine wouldn't turn over to start so I rolled it down said hill and tried to bump start it, to no avail.
I popped the bonnet, wiggled the battery leads etc, when I noticed liquid seeping out of the dipstick tube.
Overnight the diaphram in the pump had let go, allowing fuel to siphon from the tank into the block, and she was full.
Probably lucky it didn't turn over, may have gone bang big time.
Still ran fine after the repairs so the fact that it was a gravel road probably saved it from hydraulicing and bending all the rods.
 

[Matt]

I was a Bosch brand cylindrical electric pump, it runs on 3psi (will have to double check the brand and psi, as I did use 2 square noisy ones that both started leaking within 12months). This pump is silent, unless your ear is against it, but when it starts sucking air (which mine has done a few times  ) it gets noisy and so for running dry a couple of timeshasnt worried it. I have mine mounyed it the side box that is forward of the fuel tank, on the indoard side of the box. I also use that box to store a snatch-strap, spout for a Jerry can, a socket set and a Nissan emergency tools bag,all fits without hassle. (also keep in mind I have a body mod for top opening side boxes)

[Terry]

Hi,

I have Goss mechanical pumps on my Mokes and with the twin tank set up on DS I actual run the lines dry more often than I like, particularly if I am sitting at idle when the last surge occurs. Within about 30 to 45 seconds it will draw fuel out of either tank just on the starter motor or if I am moving less than 10 seconds.

Terry

[spider]

Hi,

I have Goss mechanical pumps on my Mokes and with the twin tank set up on DS I actual run the lines dry more often than I like, particularly if I am sitting at idle when the last surge occurs. Within about 30 to 45 seconds it will draw fuel out of either tank just on the starter motor or if I am moving less than 10 seconds.

Terry

The Goss and the SU Mechanical Pumps are quite good and my experience with them is similar to yours here but both are NLA (although I do still have a few) and they still have pipework too close to the hot stuff for my liking, although the Goss does fare better.

At the end of the day, there really is little between elect vs mech.

[Terry]

Hi,

The Goss G700E mechanical pump has the outlets away from the exhaust where as G702 has them almost 180 apart. Fitted to minis from 70-77. During the 60's G195 was fitted and they also have the outlets together like the G700E.

I have just order a couple of repair kits, 631VC, for mine and at trade rate is nearly as much as buying a new electric pump.

A G700E Goss Fuel pump.


Terry